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Equality

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My Lords, I thank the noble and learned Lord the Minister for opening the debate in that way. He says that he looks forward to a learned debate. I fear that I will not be able to start at that level, but I hope that others will raise the level...

Member
Baroness Hayter of Kentish Town (Labour)
Type
Proceeding contributions
Date
14 February 2013
Reference
743 cc785-7
House
House of Lords

My Lords, I enter this important debate with some trepidation. I cannot help wishing that the Deputy Prime Minister was able to say the same thing. A letter received by the Constitution Committee from the secretary to the Catholic Bishop of Nottingham criticised the,

“nonchalance with which the Deputy Prime Minister...

Member
Lord Lang of Monkton (Conservative)
Type
Proceeding contributions
Date
14 February 2013
Reference
743 cc787-790
House
House of Lords

My Lords, I wish to begin by expressing admiration for the attitude that has been taken by the 16 realms towards the appropriate changes to the succession to the Crown. It is almost beyond debate that the gender disqualification should be removed in the 21st century. I do not wish...

Member
Lord Maclennan of Rogart (Liberal Democrat)
Type
Proceeding contributions
Date
14 February 2013
Reference
743 cc790-1
House
House of Lords

Is the Church of Scotland an established Church? I think not.

Member
Lord Trefgarne (Conservative)
Type
Proceeding contributions
Date
14 February 2013
Reference
743 c791
House
House of Lords

Yes, it is an established Church. It seems to me that the time has come to recognise that the essence of Christianity is tolerance and to love thy neighbour as thyself. That cannot be entirely consistent with an exclusive attitude towards other religions. This is not a matter that presses...

Member
Lord Maclennan of Rogart (Liberal Democrat)
Type
Proceeding contributions
Date
14 February 2013
Reference
743 c791
House
House of Lords

I understand why they entered into our constitution but to judge people on the basis of their belief, because they have been given permission by the hierarchy of the Church to which they belong to disobey the laws of the state, seems not to connect the individual with the Crown....

Member
Lord Maclennan of Rogart (Liberal Democrat)
Type
Proceeding contributions
Date
14 February 2013
Reference
743 c792
House
House of Lords

I entirely agree with my noble friend. It seems to me that we should not allow our future disposition on the succession to the Crown to be governed by what happened in the 1570s, which to my mind was a period of shame.

Member
Lord Maclennan of Rogart (Liberal Democrat)
Type
Proceeding contributions
Date
14 February 2013
Reference
743 c792
House
House of Lords

On both sides—I accept that. I hope that we can accept as a very valuable step in the right direction the provisions of this Bill, which recognise that marriage to a Roman Catholic is acceptable by the heir. The fact that there are so many unresolved questions seems not entirely...

Member
Lord Maclennan of Rogart (Liberal Democrat)
Type
Proceeding contributions
Date
14 February 2013
Reference
743 c792
House
House of Lords

My Lords, I declare an interest as a former Lord Chamberlain of Her Majesty’s Household and I welcome this Bill. I find it difficult to be quite as gloomy as some of the remarks we have heard so far from noble Lords because essentially, as the Minister said, the heart...

Member
Lord Luce (Crossbench)
Type
Proceeding contributions
Date
14 February 2013
Reference
743 cc792-4
House
House of Lords

I am most grateful to the right reverend Prelate for giving way. As a member of the Church of Scotland, could he help me with why it necessarily follows that if the sovereign were allowed to be a Catholic, the position of the established church would be undermined? This may...

Member
Lord Forsyth of Drumlean (Conservative)
Type
Proceeding contributions
Date
14 February 2013
Reference
743 c795
House
House of Lords

My Lords, in rising to intervene in this debate, let me start by saying that a powerful case can be made for the line of descent for the Crown being through the sovereign’s eldest child rather than the eldest son in the first instance. That said, I am not sure...

Member
Lord Trefgarne (Conservative)
Type
Proceeding contributions
Date
14 February 2013
Reference
743 cc795-7
House
House of Lords

My Lords, I give this Bill my enthusiastic welcome. The issues have been debated frequently, there has been a succession of Private Members’ Bills, one of which I introduced to this House about nine years ago, and nobody can say that the topic is not pretty well understood.

I shall refer...

Member
Lord Dubs (Labour)
Type
Proceeding contributions
Date
14 February 2013
Reference
743 cc797-9
House
House of Lords

My Lords, I declare an interest as father and stepfather of five admirable females, each of whom tends to treat me graciously as a kind of loyal subject.

The Bill is timely. It seeks to ensure the stability and the acceptable continuity of the realm. I happen to be, like a...

Member
Lord Carlile of Berriew (Liberal Democrat)
Type
Proceeding contributions
Date
14 February 2013
Reference
743 c799
House
House of Lords

I respectfully agree with my noble friend and the noble Lord, Lord Dubs, on this point.

My second point, which I was going to make in greater detail but will not, has already been made by my noble friend Lord Lang about consent to marriage and whether six is an adequate...

Member
Lord Carlile of Berriew (Liberal Democrat)
Type
Proceeding contributions
Date
14 February 2013
Reference
743 cc800-1
House
House of Lords

My Lords, I am grateful for the opportunity to contribute to this important debate. I, too, must declare an interest as a former member of the Queen’s Household, and I should add, if it needs adding, that what I say represents my own views alone. I share the general view...

Member
Lord Janvrin (Crossbench)
Type
Proceeding contributions
Date
14 February 2013
Reference
743 cc801-3
House
House of Lords

Walter Bagehot wrote in 1867 that,

“one-half of the human race cares … fifty times more for a marriage than a ministry”.

So it came as no surprise at all when this coalition ministry decided that the immensely popular marriage of the second in line to the Throne should be followed by...

Member
Lord Lexden (Conservative)
Type
Proceeding contributions
Date
14 February 2013
Reference
743 cc802-4
House
House of Lords

I am very grateful to my noble friend for giving way. I, too, was on the Constitution Committee when we deliberated this Bill. Could he tell us whether what he describes as the

constraints on the children of Catholics being bought up—and the Catholic Church’s perspective on that—would be different...

Member
Baroness Falkner of Margravine (Liberal Democrat)
Type
Proceeding contributions
Date
14 February 2013
Reference
743 c804
House
House of Lords

I thank my noble friend. This is a great matter. It is not possible for a child of a monarch to be eligible to take the position of the Supreme Governor of the Church of England if the monarch is a Catholic. That is why the issue arises in this...

Member
Lord Lexden (Conservative)
Type
Proceeding contributions
Date
14 February 2013
Reference
743 cc805-6
House
House of Lords

My Lords, I wholeheartedly welcome every aspect of the Bill. My peerages currently descend

on the same pattern as the monarchy. My grandmother, who held the titles, was a campaigner for gender equality, as was my mother, who held the titles after her, and, indeed, my father, so it is...

Member
Lord Lucas (Conservative)
Type
Proceeding contributions
Date
14 February 2013
Reference
743 cc806-8
House
House of Lords

My Lords, I suppose that I should declare an interest as a member of the Church of England who is married to a Catholic. Perhaps I should also declare that my eldest child is a girl who was followed by two boys. She announced that she would follow closely the...

Member
Viscount Astor (Conservative)
Type
Proceeding contributions
Date
14 February 2013
Reference
743 cc810-2
House
House of Lords