The background to these amendments has already been stated, but I briefly want to look at their importance from the other end of the telescope. It takes me back to the days when I was a GP. I am remembering two patients; one came in and told me that he...

The background to these amendments has already been stated, but I briefly want to look at their importance from the other end of the telescope. It takes me back to the days when I was a GP. I am remembering two patients; one came in and told me that he...

I am grateful to noble Lords for tabling Amendments Nos. 4 and 5. My noble friend Lord Hunt mentioned earlier that, as a general rule, we have sought in the Bill to remove arbitrary obstacles to the use of compulsion where it is called for by the risk posed by...

I am grateful to noble Lords for tabling Amendments Nos. 4 and 5. My noble friend Lord Hunt mentioned earlier that, as a general rule, we have sought in the Bill to remove arbitrary obstacles to the use of compulsion where it is called for by the risk posed by...

Perhaps I may clarify what the Minister said, because I was really quite struck by it. It is not at all uncommon for people of any age or either gender to achieve sexual excitement and satisfaction through partial self-asphyxiation. It is not a one-off; it is regular behaviour. It is...

Perhaps I may clarify what the Minister said, because I was really quite struck by it. It is not at all uncommon for people of any age or either gender to achieve sexual excitement and satisfaction through partial self-asphyxiation. It is not a one-off; it is regular behaviour. It is...

The key question is whether the person has a mental disorder and how the criteria for that mental disorder are defined. The fact that that person has what we would regard as a sexual deviancy does not mean that they have a mental disorder. It is important to remember that...

The key question is whether the person has a mental disorder and how the criteria for that mental disorder are defined. The fact that that person has what we would regard as a sexual deviancy does not mean that they have a mental disorder. It is important to remember that...

I support Amendment No. 5. It would be wrong to prevent the treatment of someone suffering from alcohol or drug abuse if they had a co-existing mental disorder. It is well-known that alcohol or drug abuse, or both, can exacerbate a mental illness such as schizophrenia. Some years ago, I...

I support Amendment No. 5. It would be wrong to prevent the treatment of someone suffering from alcohol or drug abuse if they had a co-existing mental disorder. It is well-known that alcohol or drug abuse, or both, can exacerbate a mental illness such as schizophrenia. Some years ago, I...

It seems to me that this particular group brings us to the heart of some real difficulties in applying legislation, and the law in general, to mental illness. It is not like physical illness; it is about the very essence of people and what they are, which is a very...

It seems to me that this particular group brings us to the heart of some real difficulties in applying legislation, and the law in general, to mental illness. It is not like physical illness; it is about the very essence of people and what they are, which is a very...

That would be extremely helpful, because it seems to me that the Minister’s answer does not clarify things. If some further thought were given to it, perhaps the inconsistencies might become even more apparent.

That would be extremely helpful, because it seems to me that the Minister’s answer does not clarify things. If some further thought were given to it, perhaps the inconsistencies might become even more apparent.

I shall certainly write to the noble Lord. I am not aware that it is suggested that the commission, or likely commission, of illegal or disorderly acts is, by itself, a clinically recognised mental disorder. Hence, the proposed exclusion is again unnecessary. It has been suggested by noble Lords, and...

I shall certainly write to the noble Lord. I am not aware that it is suggested that the commission, or likely commission, of illegal or disorderly acts is, by itself, a clinically recognised mental disorder. Hence, the proposed exclusion is again unnecessary. It has been suggested by noble Lords, and...

The noble Baroness, Lady Murphy, in one of her fascinating contributions—she opens a world to me of which I know nothing—reminded us of how psychiatry was used in Russia, Germany and so on in comparatively recent history and she added that this was done in many cases with the best...

The noble Baroness, Lady Murphy, in one of her fascinating contributions—she opens a world to me of which I know nothing—reminded us of how psychiatry was used in Russia, Germany and so on in comparatively recent history and she added that this was done in many cases with the best...

Of course we will consider the point of view that might be expressed by that group of people. But we have to distinguish between the democratic system in which we live and the system that existed previously in the Soviet Union, East Germany and other countries under the Soviet flag....

Of course we will consider the point of view that might be expressed by that group of people. But we have to distinguish between the democratic system in which we live and the system that existed previously in the Soviet Union, East Germany and other countries under the Soviet flag....

The Minister said at the beginning of his remarks that if the amendment in the name of the noble Lord, Lord Rix, were passed, there would be a danger that some people with learning disabilities who needed compulsory treatment would not get it. Why should the situation be any different...

The Minister said at the beginning of his remarks that if the amendment in the name of the noble Lord, Lord Rix, were passed, there would be a danger that some people with learning disabilities who needed compulsory treatment would not get it. Why should the situation be any different...

I would prefer to write to the noble Baroness on some of the points that she raises. As a general point, we consider that there is a need to ensure that the position of people with learning disabilities is covered and that there are specific circumstances in which it is...

I would prefer to write to the noble Baroness on some of the points that she raises. As a general point, we consider that there is a need to ensure that the position of people with learning disabilities is covered and that there are specific circumstances in which it is...

The noble Lord, Lord Rix, has once again spoken very powerfully on an issue in whichhe is an expert. I have huge sympathy with the points that he has made. He is passionate—rightly so—about the distinction between learning disability and mental disorder. He does not want to see one confused...

The noble Lord, Lord Rix, has once again spoken very powerfully on an issue in whichhe is an expert. I have huge sympathy with the points that he has made. He is passionate—rightly so—about the distinction between learning disability and mental disorder. He does not want to see one confused...

I am very grateful to the noble Lord, Lord Rix. I read his speech on Second Reading, and I understood that he would be tabling the amendment. His amendment seeks to ensure that people with a learning disability couldnot be detained for treatment, made subject to guardianship, or placed on...

I am very grateful to the noble Lord, Lord Rix. I read his speech on Second Reading, and I understood that he would be tabling the amendment. His amendment seeks to ensure that people with a learning disability couldnot be detained for treatment, made subject to guardianship, or placed on...

I persuaded the noble Lord, Lord Rix, that he could escape from Wimbledon while his neighbours were taking children to the local school and, therefore, persuaded him into 9.30 meetings of the Joint Committee—a proposition he resisted strongly to begin with. I, too, was then treated to his knowledge—and that...

I persuaded the noble Lord, Lord Rix, that he could escape from Wimbledon while his neighbours were taking children to the local school and, therefore, persuaded him into 9.30 meetings of the Joint Committee—a proposition he resisted strongly to begin with. I, too, was then treated to his knowledge—and that...

I speak to Amendment No. 5 in my name. The Bill rightly clarifies that dependence on alcohol or drugs is not a mental disorder that justifies compulsory treatment. By making this clear, however, it could inadvertently mean that a person with a dual diagnosis of a mental disorder and dependence...

I speak to Amendment No. 5 in my name. The Bill rightly clarifies that dependence on alcohol or drugs is not a mental disorder that justifies compulsory treatment. By making this clear, however, it could inadvertently mean that a person with a dual diagnosis of a mental disorder and dependence...

As I was getting ready to talk about this amendment, I was taken back many years—more than I care to remember—to a time when I was quite young. I was walking down a street in America where a lady was behaving in a very loud fashion: she was preaching in...

As I was getting ready to talk about this amendment, I was taken back many years—more than I care to remember—to a time when I was quite young. I was walking down a street in America where a lady was behaving in a very loud fashion: she was preaching in...

A subtext runs beneath many of the Government’s proposals. I say, ““Mind the gap””. In trying to change the 1983 Act, the Government, in almost every single clause, are concerned to try to include patients who have been excluded from the 1983 Act as a result of poor psychiatric practice....

A subtext runs beneath many of the Government’s proposals. I say, ““Mind the gap””. In trying to change the 1983 Act, the Government, in almost every single clause, are concerned to try to include patients who have been excluded from the 1983 Act as a result of poor psychiatric practice....

Those were the New Year’s greetings that I expected, whether from the noble Lord, Lord Warner, or from his replacement. I knew that the Government would say what they did, because in my discussions with the Bill team last week and in the two letters that I received, in particular...

Those were the New Year’s greetings that I expected, whether from the noble Lord, Lord Warner, or from his replacement. I knew that the Government would say what they did, because in my discussions with the Bill team last week and in the two letters that I received, in particular...

moved Amendment No. 4: 4: Clause 3, page 2, leave out lines 22 and 23 and insert— ““““(3) For the purposes of subsection (2), a person shall not be considered to have a mental disorder as defined in this section solely on the grounds of the following— (a) his substance...

moved Amendment No. 4: 4: Clause 3, page 2, leave out lines 22 and 23 and insert— ““““(3) For the purposes of subsection (2), a person shall not be considered to have a mental disorder as defined in this section solely on the grounds of the following— (a) his substance...